Who says Republicans have no sense of humor?

He certainly would make a great VP for Hillary. I wonder if she smokes Cuban cigars?????

I think Bill & Monica know all about.....ahh never mind.

Jeez Jubal! Are you calling us Dems Communists?

Yep, he's calling us Dems Communists. Reeps call us Communists, terrorists, and unpatriotic. But then they turn around and say they never do.

I was at a Republican meeting one time at which the speaker talked about whiny Dems who make false claims about being called names by Republicans. Afterwards I told one of the Republicans there, a very nice person who I like a lot, that the comment was total nonsense and that I get called unpatriotic practically every week. He was surprised, as the only thing he's ever heard is the propaganda message that we're making it up.

Jeez, get a sense of humor, will you?

The Left has long been soft on Fidel and his whole "dictator thing" because they swoon over Cuba's universal health care and high literacy rates. That hero of the Left, Michael Moore, traveled to that worker's paradise and extolled Cuban health care in "Sicko," which all the Lefties went out and watched.

I was poking fun, not calling Democrats communists.

I am happy to laugh along. Where did you find that photo - it looks like the head got photoshopped.

Castro better hope his pals can stay in power at least as long as he lives. Real justice would be a trial for his crimes. Real justice would be Fidel hanging from the gallows in downtown Havanna.

Jubal you sort of make the left's point with this statement:

The Left has long been soft on Fidel and his whole "dictator thing" because they swoon over Cuba's universal health care and high literacy rates.

Can you point to a democracy in Central America that had as a high a standard of living as Cuba?

Can you point to a democracy in Central America that had as a high a standard of living as Cuba?

You're kidding, right?

Fidel took Cuba from having the 3rd highest per capita GDP in the Western Hemisphere to a poverty-stricken basket case where basics likes electricity, meat and poultry are sporadically available.

Your comment reminds me of liberals in the 1970s and 1980s who'd make excuses for the USSR by saying "Well, at least everyone in the Soviet Union has a job!"

Time to take the Fidel-colored glasses off. But thanks for making my point for me. Who needs freedom as long as the government provides free health care (regardless of how crummy)?

These libs do not change. Offer free government goodies, and they'll bargain away chunks of freedom.

Fidel took Cuba from having the 3rd highest per capita GDP in the Western Hemisphere to a poverty-stricken basket case where basics likes electricity, meat and poultry are sporadically available.

Can you point me to that factoid?

If that is true I would like to see how that GDP was distributed. If people were all fat and happy they would have had no reason to overthrow Bautista. Castro and his followers clearly had support from those who were not part of those experiencing the wonders of capitalism. The basics that are sporadically available only puts Cuba in lock step with the other democracies in Central America.

I do like your health care slant. You don't actually labor under the pretense that free market forces are in play in our health care system, do you?

OMG. It seems not all the Fidel apologists are in Cuba.

That's no factoid from Jubal. It would take much research on your part to verify it.

The basics that are sporadically available only puts Cuba in lock step with the other democracies in Central America.

"Other democracies..."

Earth to 8AF: Cuba is not a democracy.

"...in Central America."

Hate to break it to you, but Cuba is an island in the Caribbean, not a country in Central America.

And you comparison would be news to the people of Costa Rica, Belize, Honduras, etc.

OMG. It seems not all the Fidel apologists are in Cuba.

That's no factoid from Jubal. It would take much research on your part to verify it.

Where am I apologizing for Castro? That's a lot of water to carry and you're proving you're not Gunga Din.

When one takes away the cha cha cha, Castro was just another communist military dictator with all that that implies.

Realistically, during the Cold War, these small, impoverished Latin American countries had two choices:

Agree to be a US client state, using authoritarian business, church and military (or paramilitary) interests to enrich the few, send resources north as needed and keep the people down; or say "Yanqui go home" and develop a marriage of convenience with the Soviets.

Neither alternative was very attractive.

For decades Castro's defiance was useful in pointing out the true nature of US intervention in much of the world, as long as one took his proclamations of a workers' paradise with several grains of salt. Objectively, I believe that in fact the standard of living in Cuba was better than that of many Latin American countries, and the very real oppression that took place there deserves to be both condemned and placed in context compared to that which took place in Honduras, Guatemala, El Salvador, etc.

Jubal made the claim about Cuba's standing in the Western Hemisphere prior to Castro. It's up to him to prove it, not me.

Hate to break it to you, but Cuba is an island in the Caribbean, not a country in Central America.

And you comparison would be news to the people of Costa Rica, Belize, Honduras, etc.

Fair enough. You want to be pedantic about it I'll be more specific. Then how does Cuba's standard of living compare to other nations of similar size in Central and South America? Does that help?

For decades Castro's defiance was useful in pointing out the true nature of US intervention in much of the world...

Castro as truth-telling whistleblower? That's a good one. Thanks fore the exercise in moral equivalence.

You want to be pedantic about it I'll be more specific.

I didn't realize correcting error was "pedantic."

Castro as truth-telling whistleblower? That's a good one. Thanks fore the exercise in moral equivalence.

He was extremely useful in pointing out US interventions to the rest of the world as a Soviet client. Very useful from a propaganda perspective.

I didn't realize correcting error was "pedantic."

I realize there is a certain glee some bloggers take in a 'gotcha' moment. So I won't be the one to take away your victory dance.

But here is the fact of the matter. Folks like Castro can only come to power if the majority of people believe they are not only not participating in the economic prosperity of a nation, they have no chance of participating. You may bash Cuba's health care system. Fair enough. But an individual who believes themselves to be excluded would rather have crummy healthcare as opposed to none at all. I've been to two of the Central American nations you mention. I've spoken with some of the folks in the countryside who look at the chickens running around the yard as tonight's dinner. I can assure you they don't sit around and gloat about how much better they have it than their counterparts in Cuba. A nation that excludes it's people for the benefit of the very few does so at its own peril. I was born about five years before Castro came to power. But given how quickly Bautista fled the country only tells me that while Cuba may have one of the highest GDP's per capita in the Western Hemisphere few benefitted. It opened the door for someone like Castro to come along. A couple of assassination attempts and a US backed invasion only cemented his leadership within the Cuban people who helped him come to power. The downside is that he had no intention of relinquishing that power via the electoral process.

One can only hope that whatever the future of Cuba, it includes a president and government that believes in free and fair elections that will allow orderly transitions of power that we enjoy in the US. And some sense of self determination.

I've never understood our trade policy with Cuba given how eagerly we embrace trading with both China and Vietnam. Communist nations that have the same or maybe even worse human rights records.

"I've never understood our trade policy with Cuba given how eagerly we embrace trading with both China and Vietnam"

Then you weren't paying attention to the General Election results from Florida in 2000. Florida has been a key swing state in presidential politics for years. No one who wants to take FLA can afford to insult the large, anti-Castro element in the Dade County environs.

RP,

I've paid very close attention. It continues to stun me how such a small minority can control trade policy that is detrimental to both nations.

Might be one of the many reasons why I'll never be President.