Matt,

SOAR even hired people to go door-to-door to hang fliers for a "signature gathering rally" for this weekend out here in Anaheim Hills.

They must be desperate for signatures.

Paid Disney signature gatherers were greeting female customers at the 99cent store in Anaheim with remarks like "nice ass".

Disney's hand picked signature coordinator called a SunCal counter petitioner a "black bitch".
Disney is turning Anaheim into anything over than the friendliest place on earth.

The SunCals of the world come and go.

Don't bet against The Mouse.

Funny, that the people I see in the videos all seem to know each other. I see more people with the small clip boards than the large book that Councilman Hernandez forced the Disney people to use so that the petition could not be mailed out to be signed.

If you went to or have seen the 6 hour concil meeting on the web you would have seen the Suncal mouthpiece complain about how the Disney petitioners were for the first petition that will put a vote on the ballot that any changes to the Resort Plan will have to be approved by all the voters in our city, just not three council members who can be easily influenced by a developer who could care less out our city and is pulling a cruel joke on the low income people of our city and the resort workers that this about low income housing. This is about a greedly developer to make an obscene amount of money and in doing so will be taking money from our city's tax base that will be used to fund additonal city services such as police and fire. THE REAL QUESTION IS WHO DO YOU WANT TO BELIEVE, ALL THE BUSINESSES OF THE ANAHEIM RESORT OR THE GREEDY DEVELOPER WHO WANTS TO MAKE A MILLIONS OF DOLLARS BY FLIPPING (SELLING) THE PROPERTY BECAUSE HE HAS BEEN ABLE TO INFULUENCE THREE OF OUR COUNCIL MEMBERS. WHY IS SUNCAL AFRAID THAT THIS ISSUE BE PUT TO A VOTE? THE ANSWER IS THAT ONCE THE VOTERS OF ANAHEIM SEE THROUGH THE SMOKE SCREEN OF LIES BEING PUT OUT BY THE DEVELOPER WILL VOTE TO RECIND THE COUNCIL VOTE. THIS IS WHAT THIS WHOLE THING IS ABOUT. IT IS ABOUT DEVELOPER GREED AND HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH AFFORDABLE HOUSING. I INVITE YOU TO GO TO THE SUNCAL WEBSITE AT WWW.SUNCAL.COM AND IN SEARCH, TYPE IN EITHER AFFORDABLE HOUSING OR LOW COST HOUSING. GUESS WHAT? NOTHING WILL SHOW. OF COURSE MAYBE THEY WILL PUT IN SOMETHING, BUT IF YOU HURRY YOU WILL FIND OUT THAT THEY ARE INTO HIGH END HOUSING. HOMES WITH EQUESTRIAN CENTERS, ETC., BUT NOT ONE MENTION OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING. OUR CITY HAS ITS FAIR SHARE OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, AND WITH THE RECENT ANNEXATION OF THE AREA IN EAST ANAHEIM, WE HAVE OVER 65 SQUARE MILES OF CITY WHERE AFFORDABLE HOUSING CAN BE PUT OUTSIDE OF THE ANAHEIM REORT.

By the way this developer does not own the land, but only has an option to buy should the people of our city believe their well crafted lies. They did so knowing that they could influence three of our council members and only Mayor Pringle and Councilman Sidhu saw through their deception.

There was a picture in the OC register in an article on the Gene Autry Drive-Haster Drive expansion will go forward. It showed two mobile home at the subject property with a hotel looming in the background. I don't know about you, but I would not like to raise a family there. The Anaheim Resort is a place to take your families and is not a place to raise them.

SIGN THE PETITION AND LET THE PEOPLE VOTE, DON'T LET A SLEAZY DEVELOPER TAKE AWAY YOUR RIGHTS.

Hate to tell you this, but those folks going door to door for SOAR are ANAHEIM RESIDENTS, and we are mad as Hell at SunCal and our 3 arrogant council members. This is not a Disney thing. I would be out there day and night along with my neighbors, with or without Disney. This is my town, and if Council screws with the zoning in the Resort, my neighborhood is next. Never, ever, bet against someone fighting for their homes and families. I do not work for the mouse, but I am VERY grateful for their backing right now, because I could not afford to print those huge books that Council forced us to carry with the way they worded the changes. SunCal is also being RUDE and pushy and alienating folks, along with Bob Hernandez shooting himself in the foot. More people WANT to sign the referendum after Bob's call went out! As soon as we chase SunCal out of town we are going after those 3 on Council next. Done. Over with. Had it.

Oh, and the reason for the rally in the parks is not desperation to gather signatures. We have discovered that people are overwhelmingly in favor of signing the referendum. We have more people wanting to sign than are out gathering signatures. Putting the books in a central location that people can get to allows them the opportunity to sign what they want to sign. They are THANKING me for going door to door giving them the chance to sign it!

I'll be shocked if Disney doesn't qualify this referendum after the huge resources they are pouring into this.

What's next? Free annual passports if you sign the petition?

Oh well. It's Disney's town and Pringle and Sidhu want to keep it that way.

But it is funny to see Disney paying for all those people to just stand around.

Let the residents of Anaheim decide. What do you fear Suncal?

I have one word for Kring, Galloway and Herandez. RECALL

As a volunteer going door to door in my neighborhood, I am absolutely appalled at the tactics used by Sun Cal as they try to block the residents of Anaheim from exercising their right to vote. As a resident I wasted my time asking the above mentioned council people to support the Resort. I was too innocent to know that they had already sold out long before. My neighborhood have lost all respect for these people and that is what we hear as we go door to door trying to protect our city from these unscrupulous developers. I'm very affronted when the Sun Cal people talk about the aggressive tactics of the Soar petitioners. We are respectful and patient and willing to spend the time explaining what exactly is going on in our great City.
We will not quit this time and it is edifying to see such unity and support for Disney who have made this city what it is.

Barry:

Are you appalled that SOAR circulators routinely tell voters outright lies in order to get them to sign the referendum petition, as they also did with the initiative before that?

And even though Disney has changed paid circulator companies, the same lies are being told, so it's pretty clear who's providing them with their message.

SunCal/Protect Anaheim circulators are using the same public space as the Disney/SOAR circulators. Disney doesn't own the sidewalks. What I'm sensing is apoplexy that instead of simply laying down, that anyone is willing to dispute the will of the Disney Corporation in this matter.

The champions of democracy on this thread exhibit a low tolerance for any disagreement with Disney.

I know this will never happen, but I have this recurring fantasy of Disney sending out the following press release:

Disney finds win, win solution for Anaheim.

Given the recent decision by a majority of City Council members to prioritize new low income housing above the commitments made to businesses in the resort area, we have decided to close Anaheim Disneyland. We have secured sufficient property in ___________ (South County, San Diego County, near the Great Park) and will build a new, bigger, better park that will provide an even greater entertainment experience for our visitors. The land we have secured will also guarantee our ability to continue to expand the new park into the next century. We are also pleased to announce that a majority of hotels, restaurants and other existing Resort Area business have secured sites in close proximity to our new location, and will be joining us in this new venture.

We want to thank the people of Anaheim for their support over the years, and assure you that we, and the other resort area businesses, would really love to stay. Unfortunately, our trust in the City government, which justified our continued investment to operate and expand our businesses in the resort area, no longer exists. Given that, major resort area businesses can no longer continue to justify additional investment in these location to shareholders.

On the bright side, this decision will allow the City of Anaheim an increased opportunity to provide the low income housing they feel is so desperately needed in this area. They can now include the entire former resort area, and increase the numbers of required low income housing units in those developments. This will add thousands of new Anaheim residents who will not have to be inconvenienced by the traffic and noise that Disneyland, and the other major hotels, restaurants and businesses, now brings to this area. These new residents will be able to enjoy their new homes knowing that we will not be a thorn in their side, and they will not have to file law suits to secure a quiet and safe neighborhood environment for their families.

Since all the Disney zombies here are so in love with the idea of letting "the residents of Anaheim" decide, then let's put Disney's expansion plans to a vote?

And every time Disney makes any change in those plans, let's put it to another vote.

I'm sure all the pro-Disney commenters here would be willing to endorse that idea and lobby Disney to put it's new theme park to a city-wide vote.

How about it?

Morning Coffee:

You mean, Disney should say that if they don't get to run the city of Anaheim, they're going to take their marbles and go home?

I'd love to see that to so people can see Disney for what it really is.

Any other scare tactics up your sleave?

Jubal: I'm curious -- with your fetish for posting every bit of political junk mail that crosses your 'transom', why is it that you haven't posted a copy of the SunCal-sponsored letter sent last week in the name of Mayor Pro Tem Hernandez? Being a SunCal consultant, I'm sure that you could've put your hands on a copy.

Perhaps because it's full of the doubletalk and lies that you'd like us all to believe only SOAR is capable of? The only way that Hernandez's letter could even remotely be construed as 'truth' is if one were to subject it to Clinton-style "that depends on what the meaning of 'is' is" parsing. I'd been trying to stay disinterested in the whole SunCal thing, but listening to Hernandez slander Anaheim citizens on SunCal's dime -- not to mention his and Galloway's rather Imperial view that the referendum process somehow thwarts democracy -- was the last straw for me.

And being the seasoned political professional that you are, I'm amused at your Pollyanna-ish discovery that (gasp!) some paid circulators don't have a good grasp on the issues they're seeking signatures for. (Not to mention the fact that they may also be rude and lower-class! Imagine!) I've been avoiding guys in front of supermarkets, and getting verbally abused when I refuse to sign their petitions, for years -- you're just now waking up to the fact that these guys exist?

(Judging from Wednesday's Register article and reports on our neighborhood Yahoo group, SunCal's circulators certainly have no problems acting like paid thugs.)

There you go again. Using Jubal as a punching bag instead of making a coherent argument for your side.

I apologize for my evil twin. His blood sugar is off.

Has Jubal made a coherent argument for his side, beyond "Look! Signature circulators are scary and uneducated!"?

Given that SunCal doesn't even own the property in question, what property rights are theirs to defend? Why are the SunCal folks happy with the political process right up to the point where they get what they want -- but anything beyond that is 'undemocratic' and an effort to 'thwart the will of the voters'?

why is it that you haven't posted a copy of the SunCal-sponsored letter sent last week in the name of Mayor Pro Tem Hernandez?

Because I haven't yet. I've already posted the previous mailers, but I don't have that one in hand. And when I have the chance, I will post it along with the Irv Pickler letter. Will that make you happy?

And being the seasoned political professional that you are, I'm amused at your Pollyanna-ish discovery that (gasp!) some paid circulators don't have a good grasp on the issues they're seeking signatures for. (Not to mention the fact that they may also be rude and lower-class! Imagine!) I've been avoiding guys in front of supermarkets, and getting verbally abused when I refuse to sign their petitions, for years -- you're just now waking up to the fact that these guys exist?

I've always avoided circulators. This issue is the first time Ii've actually engaged in conversations with circulators, and it's on an issue with which I'm familiar. Yes, I was taken aback at how brazenly these guys mix fact, halt-truth and outright lies. And since the same spin comes out now matter which circulator company Disney hires, its clear they're not thinking up the "they want to put low income/Section 8/HUD housing by Disneyland and it will bring crime and undesirables into the resort district" and "the council vote nullified Disney's petition" all by themselves.

Or perhaps you're so worldly you don't mind if Disney has its circulators lie in order to get signatures?

Biff:

You could try reading past posts on this issue here on the blog where Jubal and others have made the case for SunCal. They haven't all been about circulators.

Being snarky and nasty may be fun, but it doesn't do a very good job of presenting the Magic Kingdom's case. It just makes you look snarky and nasty.

As for me, Disney and Company's rhetoric about letting the people decide strikes me as a smokescreen behind which they seek to control how others use their property.

The referendum is a perfectly legitimate tool and Team Disney has every right to use it. But don't pretend like SunCal and the other two developers seeking to build some residential in the resort district are perverting the process. They're seeking a zone changes legitimately.

And this "greedy developer" and "it's all about profits" rings very hollow coming from Disney and its allies. When did Disneyland become a non-profit?

"As for me, Disney and Company's rhetoric about letting the people decide strikes me as a smokescreen behind which they seek to control how others use their property."

Of course it is. But the City went through a big effort only a few years ago to produce a Specific Plan for the area - a big master plan in which the City sought "to control how others use their property." Should Disney (or anybody else, for that matter) have taken that process and the resultant document seriously? Will anybody ever take an Anaheim sponsored effort to do this sort of thing seriously in the future? These are merely rhetorical questions and do not reflect an editorial judgement.

Maybe the best consequence of this embroglio is that the City will have lost all credibilty to do this kind of urban planning in the future.

I would like to know what it is about Disney that gets people like Jubal so riled up - What did Disney ever do to you? We have had issues over the years with them and everything was handled in a professional manner so we are not always in lock step with the Corporation. However, this decision is downright wrong and we the people of Anaheim that care about our city will not stand idly by and watch the Resort disintegrate as directed by the three amigos. The huge number of volunteers like myself that have been tirelessly working for the past three weeks and beyond are passionate people that present the case as it is and are to be commended for caring enough to give up their time to save our resort.

Community Picnic Day Saturday, May 19th, 10am – 4pm
Please join your neighbors and SOAR for free food and family entertainment

This is your last chance to protect our police and fire services from future budget cuts. Sign the petition and help to preserve our Anaheim Resort District!

Central Anaheim
Pearson Park
400 N Harbor Blvd.
Hosts: Gail Eastman and Cynthia Ward

West Anaheim
Twila Reid Park
3100 West Orange
Hosts: Frank & Sally Feldhaus

Anaheim Hills
Peralta Canyon Park
115 N. Pinney Drive
Hosts: Todd Ament and Shirley McCracken

And when I have the chance, I will post it along with the Irv Pickler letter. Will that make you happy?

That'd be great. I just figured that if you'd had the time to cruise the supermarkets of Anaheim and videotape circulators, you'd had time to scan in a flyer and place it on your blog, and had just elected not to.

Or perhaps you're so worldly you don't mind if Disney has its circulators lie in order to get signatures?

No, I do mind. In an ideal world, all players on both sides would tell nothing but the unvarnished truth. (In a truly ideal world, nobody would use paid circulators; it'd make election-time shopping a lot more pleasant ...) But you can't pretend that SunCal reps have been saints throughout this episode. In the long term, I think that doubletalk and lies from Bob Hernandez are more harmful than lies coming from a minimum-wage guy standing in front of a Ralphs. And for you to focus on these people -- who are the most likely to say outrageous things, and who have no 'skin in the game' compared to Anaheim homeowners and businesses -- to the extent that you have is ridiculous.

As for why some of these people are saying the same thing as the first set of circulators, I'd guess that it's because they're the same people. Petition circulating doesn't exactly strike me as the kind of job where each firm has a set of hotshots on retainer -- more likely, they've each got a similar list of phone numbers, and just work their way down the list.

[And where was your concern for truth back when circulators were out there saying anything and having people sign false paperwork in order to switch voter registrations from Dem to GOP?]

The bottom line:

Let the Disney Corporation rule Anaheim, not the people.

Corporate commie-

I don't think Disney, or any of the other major businesses in the resort area, are trying to "run the City". They have invested hundreds of millions of dollars in their projects. They own the land they sit on. They were assured the resort area would be just that..a resort area.

Now, a company that doesn't own land comes in and wants to build residential units practically next door to Disneyland, hotels, restaurants and other businesses that stay open late. When the homes are built & sold, that company goes away..and the who is left to deal with the problems of having residential so close to businesses that operate well into the evening?

I can see it now. The fireworks are too loud and scare children. The coaster rides are too loud after 8pm. The music is too loud. There is too much noise from the restaurant/hotel parking lots late at night. Our children can't get to sleep and they are tired the next day. The big trucks bringing in provisions for the day come too early and make too much noise. People are driving/parking in our neighborhoods to use local businesses...and on and on. This is NOT rocket science.

I've watched wars between Cities and neighborhoods over major supermarkets or home improvement stores going in when they back up to residential over the noise/traffic they bring. I've seen what happened when homes were built around El Toro. People bought there knowing there was a working Marine base and air strip..and as soon as they got moved in, they started complaining about the noise and other things. It was an ongoing battle until the base shut down.

The same thing is going to happen if the City allows residential to be built too close to the resort area. People will buy, then start complaining, and it will be an ongoing mess. The Council members who approved this disaster will finally see their mistake, and the existing businesses will have to face the complaints and lawsuits that will follow.

I don't think it fair to encourage major investment to build a resort area, and then change the rules half way through the game. If Anaheim wants more housing, they should help developers find land that will be compatible with residential use.

It is a good thing that no one is living there now, otherwise they would be complaining.

Some of the folks living close by are complaining, and have been for a long time. For the most part, these folks have no where else to go and aren't organized enough to make a big stink. But wait until the new housing goes in. New owners will be up in arms within a year. It's human nature and there are examples all over the place.

When people pay the prices for new homes, they expect a certain amount of peace and quiet. They can say- Ok, I know Disneyland is there and I know there is going to be some noise but I can live with it...just like they did around El Toro. After they live there for one summer, and leave their windows open at night, they *will* scream about ALL the noise associated with ALL the area businesses, and there *will* be a war!

To me, this isn't about SunCal..or any other developer. It's about a Council majority that lacks common sense and the ability to look forward. There is plenty of property in Anaheim that can be developed for residential occupancy without setting up the dynamics for a nasty fight between residents and resort area businesses. Why not let the resort area be a resort area, as promised? Why is it so important to have residential, low income or not, in a place that already has a built-in set of noise and traffic problems that are just going to get worse if the resort area is more successful and attracts more visitors? Why not put new residential where land is available and it will be more compatible?

I have represented many large corporations who want to open new locations around Orange County and developers who want to do new projects or expand existing projects. I can tell you from my almost 30 years experience that this situation has all the base components of turning into a war. When it does, who will be the bad guys? The developers? The Council members who allowed this to happen? Nope! It will be Disney and the other businesses who saw this coming and tried to stop it. They will be accused of not being "good corporate neighbors" because their business practices cause traffic and noise both during the day and at night.

It won't matter that the businesses were there first. The only thing that will matter is the residents screaming about how the quality of their lives has been damaged by these greedy corporations who are more concerned with making money than the quality of life for nearby residents. Any any consultant who has ever been involved in these issues knows I'm right.

Morning Coffee:

You're an able apologist (in the good, original sense of the word) for Disney.

Some comments on your comments:

The "We, Disney, are such a nuisance it would be inhumane to ask anyone to live near us" argument. As Anaheim H.O.M.E. pointed out, there are lots of residents living very near Disney now. And the "they're used to it" argument doesn't really wash since the exact same people haven't been living there since 1955. People move in and out of those homes. Is Disney going to call for a moratorium an anyone moving withing 2 miles of Disneyland because they think potential homeowners don't know what they're getting themselves into?

I understand there are residential projects being approved in Anaheim that are physically closer to Disneyland than Platinum Pointe -- but I don't hear altruistic protests from Disney and others that it is wrong to build homes so close to an amusement park. But these homes are outside the resort district, so that altruism goes out the window.

And funny how we don't hear the same objection regarding the thousands of residentials units approved and being built by Anaheim Stadium. Somehow, it's OK to build almost 10,000 -- and possibly more than 15,000 -- residences next to all the traffic, noise, bright lights, drinking and entertainment uses going on right next door. In fact, the council has selected a master developer to built even more homes right next door to Anaheim Stadium. Why don't we hear the some protests about the incompatibility of residences near an entertainment district?

Also, I doubt that somehow the new residents of Platinum Pointe will magically, instantaneously morph into a force that will inflict any harm on Disney. The professions of altruistic concern for their neighbors is touching, but the good folks at the Disney Corp. have amply demonstrated their bottom-line comes first.

"the good folks at the Disney Corp. have amply demonstrated their bottom-line comes first."

Fotunately the wonderful philanthropists at SunCal have brought Anaheim residents a kinder, gentler real estate speculation!

RP:

Your sarcasm is misplaced. If you're looking for hyperbole, hysteria. pretense and misinformation of which to make fun, I'd suggest Disney/SOAR.

I witnessed Hernandez hunt down two prominent SOAR petitioners in the Anaheim Arts Council Children’s Art Festival, Saturday, for a ‘heated’ discussion.
Regardless of the substance of the debate, it seems to me the Children’s Festival is NOT the right time OR the right place for a council member to attempt coercive persuasion of the opposition. It would have been the right time if he had taken his argument to the park.

( Sarah, i took about 50 pictures at 10 MegaPixels of this 'discussion' )

Your sarcasm is misplaced. If you're looking for hyperbole, hysteria. pretense and misinformation of which to make fun, I'd suggest Disney/SOAR.

If your side doesn't do that kind of stuff, you'd better tell SunCal -- whoops, excuse me, the "Coalition to Defend and Protect Anaheim" (yeah, that doesn't sound hyperbolic at all) -- that someone's been sending out mailers and using their return address, then.

Or are you prepping yourself to use the Tan Nguyen defense? "Honest, I don't know who sent out those mailers in our name!" Maybe you can join Tan and OJ in a search for the real mailer!

Biff, please chill out. You and some of these other posters make our side look bad with these childish or over-the-top remarks. We have facts to fight with. Your just playing into Jubal's stereotypes.

Sarcasm? Moi? Let's not take ourselves too seriously here. This is not a fight between good and evil. It's a fight between two big, monied interests about who can most effectively pull and persuade the strings of local government. Any other characterization is pure - hyperbole!

GREAT..!!

now, we can get this WHOLE sordid mess out in the open and take the time to expose the lies and the truth, then let the voters decide.

YOU decide.
(if you're registered in Anaheim)