Profile | Eric Ingemunson
» Follow Me on Twitter
» My Facebook
Author's Latest Posts |
- Reagan Library celebrates 99th, looks toward 100th
- "Carpetbagger" barbs traded in new Supervisor race
- Democrats examining if they can formally help Parks
- It’s on: Strickland vs. Parks
- Blogging bootcamp next week
More»
Obama supporter assaults three physicians protesting universal healthcare
By Eric Ingemunson | 08/13/09 | 01:46 AM EDT | 12 Comments
Correction--09/14/09: I finally got to see the video that was taken of the unstable man charging the doctors from angle on the opposite side from where I was at. The video gives a close up of what happened, and it looks as though the man ran right up to the doctors, one of whom jumped down from the bench on his own. He was not pushed off like I thought, and therefore was not assualted. The video was in the possession of the Ventura County Sheriffs and we were finally given a copy. I posted the video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQj-kiZOFGw
An angry man assaulted a trio of doctors who were criticizing Obama's healthcare plan outside a town hall meeting today in Thousand Oaks, CA. The doctors, who were shut out of the indoor meeting at the Thousand Oaks Public Library along with approximately one hundred anti-universal healthcare protesters, held an impromptu town hall of their own when they were attacked.
I arrived on the scene an hour before the fight. A line of about 150 people quietly waited outside the library for a chance to get into the meeting room where a panel discussion, sponsored by local Democrats, was scheduled to take place. Democrats were given first priority, which was fair because it was their show.
The doors closed with most of the anti-universal healthcare people still outside. Some of them were frustrated and protested loudly to nobody in particular.
Then the three doctors, clad in their scrubs, addressed the peaceful crowd, which formed a circle around them. After introducing themselves, they raised ethical and practical issues that medical workers will face when the government gets more involved in private healthcare decisions.
A middle-aged man began angrily shouting and suddenly pushed his way through the crowd and lunged at the doctors. With some difficulty the doctors, along with several other people in the crowd, fought off the attacker, who tore his shirt as he was wrestled to ground, ultimately being arrested by police.
The impromptu panel resumed speaking. A person announced that the he asked the Democrats if they were interested in hearing the physicians speak in their panel and they said they weren't. The crowd jeered and I wondered if they could hear them from inside the library.
Popular conservative comedian Evan Sayet added to the crowd's excitement with a rousing speech. “This is not about making our system better,” he said. “It's about turning over control from the people.”
Special thanks to Paul for the photos.
| 
|
12 Comments | Related Topics »Ventura County (CA)
RECOMMENDED SITES
Comments
This is crazy people need to learn how to act.
I applaud everyone at this meeting. They are "showing up" meaning they actually have gone beyond ambivilence and are now becoming informed (either side). It is important for both sides to be civil to each other and give both sides adequate time to ask questions and express concerns politely. I am a nurse who works in the greater Los Angeles area, (live in Ventura). I work for a very large HMO.
If our government starts its own insurance "company" they will make the premiums cheap. They do not have to balance a budget. They do not have to be able to pay the bills. They can charge whatever they want and people will flock to the coverage the government provides (until they see that it is not a plan that will cover simple things-we will get into that later). the government will raise taxes or print money to pay for the coverage. When enough people flock to the government plan, it will weaken and then make the private companies go out of business. You see there is not a "fair market value." The government is "price fixing" Once the privates go out of business there will be nothing left but the govenment. Then when you are 80 years old and fall, you will not be able to get a new hip or have your cataracts removed. You are too old. It does not matter that you play golf every day and are in excellent health. You are too old and you will "unfairly" drain the system.
There was an idiot newcaster on the LA morning show at the LA Forum yesterday interviewing South Central people on healthcare. Everyone she talked with said, yes we want it. What do you think of this? Sound a bit slanted??? The reporter actually complained that she had to pay for a $1,200 dental ill and her own contacts. Yes, she must be an idiot. Dental will not be covered in the Obama healthcare plan and contacts are not a necessity. They are a luxury! Idiot. My point is, the American people will want care that they will not be getting. We are used to demanding and getting quite a bit of great care from our insurance companies because with "fair market trade" you as a private individual can decide to go to another insurance company if you are not treated right. What will happen when only the government is the only choice?
We need to do something for those people who have pre-existing conditions. They need to be able to purchasesome kind of insurance at a reasonable rate. Maybe MediCare buy-in. (This accounts for apprx 10% of the people uninsured).
We need to limit they ridiculous lawsuits. If someone sues a hospital or doctor because they didn't fix a hangnail, and they lose the case, the person bringing the suit should pay the winners legal fees. Frivilous lawsuits would be reduced. Maybe a max liability should be put in place.
Illegal aliens need to pay into the system they are using. They use the Emergency Department for simple colds and flu. Clinics can be set up for a fee basis. Nurse Practicianers can provide excellent care and refer pts to Emergency who actually need it. (we need to protect the public from TB etc, so illegals need to be seen). But if we give free government healthcare, LOOK OUT BORDERS! We will be swamped!
Lastly, people who don't want to purchase healthcare maybe required to do so. Usually young, healthy people. They find it a waste of money. If you go to college in California, you have to contribute to their health clinic. This might work in a grander scale.
Just my thoughts. Keep getting informed ! Make your own informed decision. Don't let anyone else tell you what to think. (either side).
First, why do you support health insurance companies and the AMA? I don't understand. I further don't see how individuals are upset that the rich are going to be taxed more. Do you really have a problem with a guy making $30M a year spending $1.5M more in taxes for our healthcare? Ronald Reagan had the top earnings spending well over 60% in taxes. How do you think the government makes money?
Second, your comment that tort reform is the answer to controlling costs of healthcare is troubling. If laws are passed to further restrict how much a patient can obtain in a lawsuit, there is less incentive for attorneys to practice in medical malpractice and injured patients are left with no protection against the negligence of their doctors or hospitals.
Third, the idea that old people are not taken care of under the bill is unfounded. The fact is there is rationed healthcare right now. For those of us who can't afford to pay cash for medical treatment, we are left to the mercy of the insurance companies to provide us care. From personal experience, they do whatever is necessary to get out of paying.
Fourth, your fear that illegal aliens are robbing us of our resources is crazy. Considering that they are the backbone of the California economy, allowing them to come into the emergency room becuase they are so sick, is an expense that we can all afford to take. This is considering that they do so much work that native born citizens feel they are too good to do. The fact is the largest drain on expenses are the old. They need to be taken care of. One person's life is not more important than another.
Fourth, without a public healthcare option, US companies will continue to compete unsuccessfully against foreign companies because of the additional burden of providing healthcare to their employees. Foreign companies do not have this expense because every industrialized nation provides public healthcare for its citizens, except the United States.
Read at least the 35 page summary of the HR 3200...
" Do you really have a problem with a guy making $30M a year spending $1.5M more in taxes for our healthcare?"
Yes, actually I do. I'd rather he invest that money back into the free market system and hire people, invest in growing his business, or even buy a yacht -- which will employ tons of people in building, maintenance, etc. I want more rich people to keep their money so they can spend it.
Besides which, I had an interesting discussion with a sonogram tech the other day. She told me that the technology for sonograms was invented during WWII for the Navy. After the war,they didn't want to spend more money on it, so he had to find another market; he came up with medicine. It developed slowly over about two decades, but by the 1970s rich people could get sonograms and see their babies. Today, everyone gets a sonogram, and for much more than just looking at unborn children. We would not have sonograms -- or many, many other brilliant American medical technologies -- if there were not a market of wealthy people to drive that industry. We would, in short, stagnate, and the whole world would be poorer for it.
And one more thing: on paper, those $30M people are worth $30M -- but how much of that is in liquid cash? Most have their assets tied up in businesses, homes, property. Sure they could pay that $1.5M -- but their businesses would suffer, further retarding our already moribund economy. Fix medical care after our financial bedrock has stabilized, and use the time leading up to that point to develop the best possible approach -- maybe by putting the Whole Foods CEO in as an adviser to the President. Mackey's a liberal, and his very different and practical advice could help develop a REAL solution.
Oh, but what am I thinking? It's not real solutions they want, but back-door socialism.
Now what else were you saying? Oh, yeah: your tort reform "point" is stupid. You LIMIT, not cut off, what the lawyers make. I trust a doctor before a lawyer any day. But lawyers don't have to carry malpractice insurance. Did you know the typical doctor's medical malpractice insurance rate is around $70K per year?!? And everyone who deals directly with patient treatment has to carry malpractice insurance. The rates have put obstetricians in several states out of business completely -- and having fewer obstetricians does not help maternal health. So now you want to reduce the amount that doctors make, but not the level of malpractice insurance they must carry? Do you have ANY IDEA of what that will do? And do you really think you'll be able to sue a government doctor when, as will inevitably happen, doctors who can't afford to practice on their own take employment with federal and state run hospitals? Military members cannot sue for poor care from military doctors (who, btw, are generally civilians) because the government bans it. You won't be able to, either.
Your third point: Medicare today is SUBSIDIZED by private insurance; hospitals and doctors treat most Medicare patients at a loss, and must charge the privately insured people more to make up that loss. If you nationalize private insurance, a lot of Medicare patients won't get treated, or a lot of hospitals will go out of business -- you can't have both. And you can appeal to an insurance company to cover treatment -- and if they still won't you can appeal to your state insurance board. You generally still get the treatment if the doctor's pretty sure you need it - the only question is how it will be paid for. Under a government-run health system, you will not be able to get the treatment at all unless it's approved, and there will be limited or no appeals system.
Your (sigh) fourth point: Screw you and your "some jobs Americans won't do" statement. There are NO jobs Americans won't do. Now maybe there are jobs union employees won't do, but I've done some pretty crappy stuff to make ends meet for my family. Moreover, the nastiest job I know is plumbing -- and I've never had a non-American plumber come and clean out my sewage. It's more like "jobs Americans want more money for." And why? Because they have to make a living wage in America.
A while back, my father ran a construction crew in Louisville. The company he worked for shipped people in from North Carolina, where a BRAC issue had made jobs scarce. Those men cost the company significantly less than local employees - and this is not a high-wage area - because their cost of living back home had dropped so much. Same with Mexicans and, especially, Guatemalans: they live cheek-by-jowl in tiny apartments, and send most of their money back home where the cost of living is minimal. They can afford to make much less money, below minimum wage. Liberals are supposed to be pro-fair-wages; why is it in this case they support a system that destroys fair wages and exploits poor people while ensuring low-level jobs are not available to Americans? And as far as being the "backbone" of California's economy -- in case you have not noticed, that backbone just broke. If you don't pay taxes or you pay minimal taxes, a high-spending government cannot afford you unless they have rich people to pay in as well -- and the rich people left.
Old people deserve to be taken care of because when Medicare - a system we PAY for, check your paycheck stub - was instituted, they were promised that. You would not have what you have today were it not for the hard work and innovation of those old people. I don't begrudge them a single thing, none of them. Illegal immigrants, however, have NOT contributed to the system, are breaking the law to begin with, and - see above - are undermining fair wages laws that were, hello, implemented by liberals. Can you say "paid under the table?" No taxes that way. Can you also say cognitive dissonance?
Your second #4 (that's okay, it's the school system): all parrotted talking points. In case you haven't noticed, America's GDP is STILL the highest in the world, measured country-by-country. We aren't having all that much difficulty competing in a global economy. American music, clothing, food, chain stores, books, all are globally popular. (Can you say that about China or Malaysia?) It is a system that WORKS. Before fixing something that works, isn't it smart to stop and think about it for a while?
I could say SO much more, but it would take forever and I'm sure you're not listening, even if you read this. So, if your side wins, hope you enjoy the sudden stagnation and your impending unemployment and crappy health care from the gubment. I would rather not have to say "I told you so," though, so I hope some of you are listening - and more importantly, thinking.
Oh, btw, I read the whole bill tweeted, and have been reading the original piecemeal when I can stomach it. Even lawyers are still trying to figure out what it says. That is the sign of a BAD BILL.
Last night's meeting was NOT a town hall meeting. There were no politicians in attendance regardless of misinformation that had been given out by some source that Conyers himself was showing up! It was the monthly general meeting of the Democratic Club of the Conejo Valley. Our members showed an interest in the health insurance reform issue and we provided a panel of physician's to give their point of view.
We meet at the Thousand Oaks Library and, generally, there is adequate space for everyone who comes to get seated. However, this issue is a hot one right now and the room quickly filled to capacity with club members. That is not to say that others did not get in. Some did. But we really could not cram more people into the space we had. As people left the room we did try to seat others waiting outside.
I think we should all be proud that our community has this degree of interest in educating ourselves on the topic and that we could gather, some of us very disappointed, and still act civilly. I spoke to many people outside the library who were willing to attend a subsequent event, even another one of ours. I think that's great. I only wish our Congressman Gallegly would spend some quality time with his consituents on this important issue. There is clearly an audience for it. Where is he and the local Republican party? I suppose its a lot more fun just sending some folks out to disrupt events that to plan your own or to work in cooperation to truly educate people in a calm fashion.
Why would Republicans want to visit a Democrats party meeting? Who wants to be another sheep or an A$$ for that matter?
Congressman Ellton Gallegly would meet with you if you picked up the telephone and called him.
You are a fool! No wonder you post anonomously!
Gallegly's office dosen't return calls and I can't remember when he has sponsored or attended any townhall or forum. He is currently on a working break from Congress, but has publicly stated he will not be spending any time with his constituents while here. I hope he is enjoying wasting our time during his final term as a U.S. congressman. He is out of touch and inept. He has received $7,000 in dirty political contributions from the PMA Group (PAC). PMA Group (Paul Magliocchetti and Associates) was a defense lobbying group that is now the focus of multiple federal investigations concerning allegations of influence peddling and other corrupt activities, mostly associated with earmarks. Just a year ago, PMA was among the largest lobbying firms in Washington, D.C., with almost three dozen lobbyists, most of whom had congressional or Pentagon experience. PMA clients received more than $300 million in earmarks in the current fiscal year, according to Taxpayers for Common Sense. Rep. Gallegly reaped the second highest number of earmarks for PMA clients at $15.7 million. The firm’s office was raided in November by FBI agents. The company has disbanded and closed its doors. What do you think, "will Elton Gallegly return the dirty contributions?"
Capps: Busting Rumors
By Lois Capps
Don’t let the naysayers fool you. Congress is making real progress on health reform. My last vote was to pass a comprehensive health-insurance reform bill out of the Energy & Commerce Committee. The next step is passage by the full House. This bill — the America’s Affordable Health Choices Act (HR 3200) — would make healthcare more accessible, more affordable and better in quality for everyone.
Our health system is broken, bankrupting families and businesses. We spend more per capita on healthcare than any other industrialized nation, yet fare worse in infant mortality, maternal mortality and life expectancy. Congress and the Obama administration are working to reform our health-insurance system for all Americans.
Our reform bill will lower costs and bring stability and security to those with health insurance already, while extending coverage to millions of uninsured Americans. If you like your health insurance, you can keep it and benefit from lower prices and improvements to make the current system better.
Our legislation protects consumers by prohibiting insurance companies from denying coverage because of pre-existing medical conditions or refusing to cover a consumer’s medical expenses after a serious injury or diagnosis. It also ends “gender rating” policies that charge women higher premiums just because they are women, removes co-pays for preventive care services and closes the Medicare Part D “donut hole.”
Our bill brings costs down by establishing a public health insurance option to compete with private insurance companies. This will end monopolies that private companies have in most of the country and make premiums more affordable. It will also ensure you always have coverage options if you lose your job or if your employer doesn’t provide you with a plan.
Our legislation expands our health work force through education assistance for new physicians, nurses and allied health professionals. It also encourages them to practice in underserved areas.
Despite this progress, I am under no illusion that enacting common-sense health reform is an easy task. If it was, we would have done it years ago, instead of letting our broken system deteriorate for decades. Our healthcare system accounts for as much as 16 percent of our national economy and touches our lives every day. That is why we are acting with careful deliberation after scores of hearings on the need for reform.
Finally, I’d like to put to rest some of the rumors about the reform bill. It is sad that opponents of reform have resorted to spreading misinformation about this legislation, but they are making these false accusations quite loudly and you deserve to know the truth:
— Our bill will not force anyone into a government-run insurance option. Consumers may choose either a public or a private health insurance plan.
— Our bill will end the rationing of care that private insurance plans currently practice. It provides greater consumer protections and ensures decisions are made between you and your health professional.
— Our bill does not require or encourage euthanasia, nor does it require any end-of-life decisions. It does allow health professionals to be reimbursed for discussing advance-care planning options if the patient chooses to have this conversation.
— Our bill does not require federal funding of abortion services and specifically prohibits public funding for abortion, other than in the case of rape, incest or a threat to the life of the mother, as is the current law. Plans may choose to cover abortion services as long as only private funds are used to pay for such services.
— Our bill does not hurt the Medicare program, it improves it! By eliminating waste and abuse, increasing the number of health professionals, improving incentives for quality care and closing the Part D “donut hole,” seniors will be better off.
— Our bill does not cover people who are in this country illegally and specifically prohibits federal funding to provide undocumented people with health coverage.
I believe by working together we can ensure that all Americans have access to quality, affordable healthcare. We simply cannot afford to waste this opportunity.
— Rep. Lois Capps, D-Santa Barbara represents the 23rd District in Congress, which includes parts of Ventura and Santa Barbara counties.
[For more information visit the AARP website discussion of healthcare at http://aarp.convio.net/site/PageNavigator/Myths_vs_Facts ]
Capps: Busting Rumors By Lois Capps Don’t let the naysayers fool you. Congress is making real progress on health reform. My last vote was to pass a comprehensive health-insurance reform bill out of the Energy & Commerce Committee. The next step is passage by the full House. This bill — the America’s Affordable Health Choices Act (HR 3200) — would make healthcare more accessible, more affordable and better in quality for everyone. Our health system is broken, bankrupting families and businesses. We spend more per capita on healthcare than any other industrialized nation, yet fare worse in infant mortality, maternal mortality and life expectancy. Congress and the Obama administration are working to reform our health-insurance system for all Americans. Our reform bill will lower costs and bring stability and security to those with health insurance already, while extending coverage to millions of uninsured Americans. If you like your health insurance, you can keep it and benefit from lower prices and improvements to make the current system better. Our legislation protects consumers by prohibiting insurance companies from denying coverage because of pre-existing medical conditions or refusing to cover a consumer’s medical expenses after a serious injury or diagnosis. It also ends “gender rating” policies that charge women higher premiums just because they are women, removes co-pays for preventive care services and closes the Medicare Part D “donut hole.” Our bill brings costs down by establishing a public health insurance option to compete with private insurance companies. This will end monopolies that private companies have in most of the country and make premiums more affordable. It will also ensure you always have coverage options if you lose your job or if your employer doesn’t provide you with a plan. Our legislation expands our health work force through education assistance for new physicians, nurses and allied health professionals. It also encourages them to practice in underserved areas. Despite this progress, I am under no illusion that enacting common-sense health reform is an easy task. If it was, we would have done it years ago, instead of letting our broken system deteriorate for decades. Our healthcare system accounts for as much as 16 percent of our national economy and touches our lives every day. That is why we are acting with careful deliberation after scores of hearings on the need for reform. Finally, I’d like to put to rest some of the rumors about the reform bill. It is sad that opponents of reform have resorted to spreading misinformation about this legislation, but they are making these false accusations quite loudly and you deserve to know the truth: — Our bill will not force anyone into a government-run insurance option. Consumers may choose either a public or a private health insurance plan. — Our bill will end the rationing of care that private insurance plans currently practice. It provides greater consumer protections and ensures decisions are made between you and your health professional. — Our bill does not require or encourage euthanasia, nor does it require any end-of-life decisions. It does allow health professionals to be reimbursed for discussing advance-care planning options if the patient chooses to have this conversation. — Our bill does not require federal funding of abortion services and specifically prohibits public funding for abortion, other than in the case of rape, incest or a threat to the life of the mother, as is the current law. Plans may choose to cover abortion services as long as only private funds are used to pay for such services. — Our bill does not hurt the Medicare program, it improves it! By eliminating waste and abuse, increasing the number of health professionals, improving incentives for quality care and closing the Part D “donut hole,” seniors will be better off. — Our bill does not cover people who are in this country illegally and specifically prohibits federal funding to provide undocumented people with health coverage. I believe by working together we can ensure that all Americans have access to quality, affordable healthcare. We simply cannot afford to waste this opportunity. — Rep. Lois Capps, D-Santa Barbara represents the 23rd District in Congress, which includes parts of Ventura and Santa Barbara counties. [For more information visit the AARP website discussion of healthcare at http://aarp.convio.net/site/PageNavigator/Myths_vs_Facts ]
I am a local resident. Civil discourse and respect for all points of view are necessary in public event. I don't see the detractors of health care reform, immigration reform, tax reform being open to dialogue. From what I can see they only want to shout down local citizens who are presenting their point of view. This does nothing for real reform and health care for all.
People are understandably upset when a 1,000+ page bill that will fundamentally change the way we have health care in this country and our elected officials are scrambling to pass it without even knowing what is in it. What's worse is their cavalier "Dons vs. peons" attitude when confronted with their legislative malpractice. Change such as this deserves carefull, gradual implemtation to see how each of the changed components affect the overall operation of the system. That's not being done. People who care about the future of their country will not, and should not be quiet about it. This is our history and we should vocally oppose any threat to it.
Genius! This is my proof that Obama is indeed, the Anti-Christ!
Post new comment